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Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:44 pm
by DjchunKfunK
Yes, it was a F2P game, but I doubt it needed funding from card packs because Blizzard had already amassed a colossal fortune from World of Warcraft from which it draws a lot of its appeal.


No right minded developer is going to offer a game for free and then use money from another game to finance it and nor should they have to. That's just not sensible.

I think stuff like card packs are slightly different to some of the stuff being talked about here.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:49 pm
by Mantis
Hearthstone's business model is an entirely different kettle of fish.

If you're rallying against randomised premium loot content then I don't think you can pick and choose which are valid and which aren't. I wouldn't expect Blizzard to make Hearthstone for free, but then I don't think their business model stands up to scrutiny either; and that is speaking as someone who has spent over £100 on Hearthstone since launch and has a thoroughly bitter aftertaste from it. In fact, I think it was Hearthstone where everything finally clicked into place for me and I asked myself just what the hell I was doing buying so many packs.

Being a CCG doesn't excuse it at all and neither does it being free to play.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:50 pm
by Raid
DjchunKfunK wrote:I think stuff like card packs are slightly different to some of the stuff being talked about here.

Why? They're game-altering random-chance microtransactions. How is that any different to loot boxes in Battlefront 2 (which co-incidentally refers to the loot as cards)?

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:52 pm
by Mantis
If anything it's even more of a core element of the game because you literally cannot compete on the same level with people if you don't get the right cards out of your packs. The Battlefront equivalent would be if they literally locked all of the most powerful guns behind the loot crates.

Pre-ordering the Grand Tournament for £40+ and then getting absolute shite out of all the packs was the straw that broke the camels back on Hearthstone for me.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:59 pm
by Raid
I should point out that I'm not directing all of the blame for this situation at Hearthstone, merely suggesting that it helped to normalise this kind of microtransaction. I'm certainly not suggesting that it should have been entirely free; it's an excellent game and obviously it deserves to make money.

Funnily enough, the card pack business model actually meant that I didn't want to play it. I did buy packs once or twice; I can't remember exactly how much I spent on it, but it was less than a full-priced game's worth. The problem I had with it was that I kept coming across people who had amazing card combinations which I couldn't then go and use because I didn't own one or more of the cards. I don't think I ever found a legendary in a card pack. I realised quite quickly that the buzz I was getting from opening packs very quickly vanished and I was left staring at largely the same decks as I was using before.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:00 pm
by katarn
It's why I never touched Hearthstone with a bargepole. Not even the initial free install to check it out. I could see where it would lead.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:05 pm
by Sly Boots
It was when they made all the cards from older packs obsolete for normal play that did it for me. Not only did you have to shell out inordinate sums for each expansion and newly released cards, after a year they became virtually useless (pun intended).

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:18 pm
by Jez
So despite my misgivings I thought I'd try the game tonight.

Not for me - at all. The gameplay is so utterly arcade and non tactical it hurts. Too many missed opportunities in the gameplay area. I think coming from the likes of BF1 to this is much too jarring. Gave it a few hours and I cant keep it on my machine its much too shit.

Refunded.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:22 pm
by DjchunKfunK
I feel discussing HS is taking the conversation very much down a different route. Just a quick point or two, I would very much argue that paying for the expansions gave you enough cards to make a viable deck or two whether it be cards or via dust in order to craft other cards and despite it's many flaws HS does a good job of making sure the power level of cards is spread out between the various rarities meaning that the nest cards are often not Epic or Legendary.

I can appreciate that people have different opinions on this subject, but I would very much prefer it to stick to objective/subjective arguments rather than pronouncements on how people of differing opinions are somehow morally inferior.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:49 pm
by katarn
DjchunKfunK wrote:I would very much prefer it to stick to objective/subjective arguments rather than pronouncements on how people of differing opinions are somehow morally inferior.

I haven't seen any of that. Unless I've missed a little comment from someone, but scanning through the last couple of pages I'm struggling to find it.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:03 pm
by DjchunKfunK
Saying someone is part of the problem is very much making moral judgements.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:12 pm
by Sly Boots
Everyone who buys one of these slot machine loot boxes or microtransaction in a game they've already paid to buy is making a conscious decision to support the practice and encourage the companies who continue to push the envelope to get consumers to pay through the nose for their product. I regret every single pound I've spent in the past doing so, mainly the ME3 multiplayer, and will not be doing so again.

If nobody did, they wouldn't exist. I don't really see how anyone can argue with that, morality doesn't enter into it.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:16 pm
by katarn
Yeah, I think you're interpreting that to quite an extreme, dj. :?

There's absolutely nothing wrong whatsoever with the tone of opinions given in these last few pages. You're making it sound like there's been unreasonable posting going on.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:01 pm
by Jez
Dunno guys just to pitch in on DJ here but it's been close to the line.

I get the argument on both sides. I think battlefront 2 does it very badly, other games like BF1 etc do it better. When it's cosmetic only it enhances the sales for the company. I don't have an argument against this and I've supported companies like Frontier with Elite dangerous by buying skins etc guilt free. On the other hand the way it's done in battlefront 2 is shamelessly gouging with making a pay to win set up.

Re: Star Wars Battlefront 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:29 pm
by Raid
Jez wrote:I've supported companies like Frontier with Elite dangerous by buying skins etc guilt free.

That's an entirely different category of microtransaction, and one I really don't see a problem with. Unless Frontier have changed their business model, it's just a product that you've spent money on, not the chance of getting what you want. You know exactly what you're getting and exactly how much it'll cost to get it.