The Division Announced for PC

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STuG
 
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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby STuG » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:51 pm

My current go to co-op with friends. A huge amount has been added since launch especially with the last (1.8 ) patch.

The expanded Dark Zone areas added last year are a peerless example of environmental story telling. Visually in its depiction of a city overrun and incapable of containing a lethal contagion it has no equal.

As with all looter-shooters you can burn out if you grind for gear constantly, but boot it up with some friends a couple of times a week and you will have fun i am sure. Changes to the rogue system have helped quell a measure of mindless ganking too, although it does still exist in the DZ. It isn't mandatory to enter it though now with the Pier 93 map expansion for decent loot. The Underground DLC is also well worth a spin.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Jez » Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:31 pm

Could be tempted back for a reroll of my character.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Snowy » Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:04 am

I would also be up for a re-roll from scratch and a PW co-op playthrough - shall we try to get some evenings penned in?
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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby DjchunKfunK » Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:28 am

I actually found that once I had played a bit with an alt I got back into the swing of things so booted up my level 30 character and now I'm back in the swing of things.

My alt is currently sat at level 11 so I don't mind joining in with some PW co-op shenanigans.
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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby STuG » Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:11 pm

Just remember that for PvE activities 'Destructive' on your weapons and purple 'damage to Elites' mods will be your best friends when facing gold NPC's later on.

You can also re-roll 'DtE' on your gear and there is a dedicated gear set that has additional damage to them as a bonus too (strikers). You will end up shredding them.

A dedicated healer build in the squad will help too (normally a 'reclaimer' gear set build). They won't hurt anyone with their weapons due to specialising in electronics instead of firearms but they will keep the damage dealer players alive and shooting!

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Mantis » Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:57 pm

I bounced off this game when I bought it a few months ago. Played it in co-op and had an okay amount of fun, but felt like it just wasn't varied enough to stay entertaining for longer than about five hours. None of the class abilities really felt like different playstyles and the loot system was guilty of the worst kind of incremental stat upgrades with zero actual gameplay differences. When the driving factor of acquiring better loot is simply to add an extra 100 points of damage here or there to what is otherwise the same assault rifle you've used for the whole game then the system could quite easily be scrapped.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Raid » Sun Jan 21, 2018 4:28 pm

That's pretty much how I felt about it when I played it at release. They always seemed to be fairly minor stat increases too, not like Diablo where finding a good new weapon can give you 50% extra damage. These loot systems only work if you can easily see or feel the difference that an item makes, either through massive increases to stats or abilities, or different effects when the item is used. I appreciate they're constrained by the confines of the multiplayer environment and the realism of the setting, but perhaps trying to force such a loot system into such a game design was destined to fail.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Mantis » Sun Jan 21, 2018 4:33 pm

It's a classic example of Ubisoft doing what they're quite renowned for doing, which is mashing genres together and making something that ultimately doesn't quite work because it has too many pitfalls inherited from each area.

If the entire game had been designed as a co-op urban open world tactical shooter with a similar mission/quest structure (a bit like Wild Lands I guess) then it would have been a lot more fun.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby STuG » Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:46 pm

Mantis wrote:I bounced off this game when I bought it a few months ago. Played it in co-op and had an okay amount of fun, but felt like it just wasn't varied enough to stay entertaining for longer than about five hours. None of the class abilities really felt like different playstyles and the loot system was guilty of the worst kind of incremental stat upgrades with zero actual gameplay differences. When the driving factor of acquiring better loot is simply to add an extra 100 points of damage here or there to what is otherwise the same assault rifle you've used for the whole game then the system could quite easily be scrapped.


Out of interest, how far into the game did you get (character level-wise)? Level 30 or gear score 256?

I disagree on the named gear sets not allowing a differing play style to each other. A sniper 'Sentry' or 'Deadeye' build will produce entirely different results to someone having fun setting the world on fire with a 'firecrest' set for example.

With regards to stats...the game is very much a min/max experience at heart in the 'end game.' A few additional % does and will make a difference to how encounters play out.

A case in point. On one of my PvE builds i recently swapped out a 'gold' gear mod that gave me an increased firearms score (DPS totals means nothing in the game really, your firearms total determines your per bullet damage and the gear score of the weapon determines the maximum damage level per bullet the weapon can attain) for a lesser purple tier mod that had a 3% 'damage to elites' bonus, lesser firearms meant lesser damage, but the 3% bonus that stacked with my other DtE damage bonuses makes a difference and puts down the golden/armoured NPC's far faster than a player without them.

I appreciate that kind of tinkering isn't everyone's cup of tea, but that is what the game is really at heart and has kept me entertained over the last year.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Jez » Sun Jan 21, 2018 6:07 pm

Was hovering over the install button yesterday evening but i hesitated mostly because of the download time and short on space on the Hard Drive. so instead decided on a few rounds of BF1. I know its a different sort of game but its just an amazingly good experience. Such great moment to moment gameplay.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Mantis » Sun Jan 21, 2018 7:11 pm

STuG wrote:
Mantis wrote:I bounced off this game when I bought it a few months ago. Played it in co-op and had an okay amount of fun, but felt like it just wasn't varied enough to stay entertaining for longer than about five hours. None of the class abilities really felt like different playstyles and the loot system was guilty of the worst kind of incremental stat upgrades with zero actual gameplay differences. When the driving factor of acquiring better loot is simply to add an extra 100 points of damage here or there to what is otherwise the same assault rifle you've used for the whole game then the system could quite easily be scrapped.


Out of interest, how far into the game did you get (character level-wise)? Level 30 or gear score 256?

I disagree on the named gear sets not allowing a differing play style to each other. A sniper 'Sentry' or 'Deadeye' build will produce entirely different results to someone having fun setting the world on fire with a 'firecrest' set for example.

With regards to stats...the game is very much a min/max experience at heart in the 'end game.' A few additional % does and will make a difference to how encounters play out.

A case in point. On one of my PvE builds i recently swapped out a 'gold' gear mod that gave me an increased firearms score (DPS totals means nothing in the game really, your firearms total determines your per bullet damage and the gear score of the weapon determines the maximum damage level per bullet the weapon can attain) for a lesser purple tier mod that had a 3% 'damage to elites' bonus, lesser firearms meant lesser damage, but the 3% bonus that stacked with my other DtE damage bonuses makes a difference and puts down the golden/armoured NPC's far faster than a player without them.

I appreciate that kind of tinkering isn't everyone's cup of tea, but that is what the game is really at heart and has kept me entertained over the last year.


From memory I think I reached about level 16/17ish, but by then my co-op buddy had begun to get a bit sick of the missions so we packed in.

The thing is, I really like the whole min/max concept in a lot of RPGs. It's the bread and butter of something like Path of Exile or Diablo and those games are great. I just don't think it's particularly well suited to a modern military shooter which is constrained by realism. I don't want to just be a sniper or close quarters shotgun expert. In a shooter I want to be able to do both of those things flexibly, that's why games like Battlefield are so fun because you can swap your play style in an instant. If you're going to tie someone to a class for an entire game then the abilities need to be really gripping for it to not get tiresome.

Destiny is a trash game for many reasons, but one thing it did get right was in how it gave you meaningful differences in how the classes played and how they worked around the core shooting element. I realise that Destiny is a futuristic sci-fi shooter and so is able to take a lot of liberty in how it approaches that subject, but when you strip the context out I feel like on a mechanical level it nicely highlights the point I'm trying to make on how the two games differ.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby DjchunKfunK » Sun Jan 21, 2018 7:22 pm

You can be both a sniper and a close range shotgunner, the game allows you to setup various loadouts. The only way the game ties you to a style of play is near the start when you have to choose which tree to start unlocking first, but once you have all the main skills unlocked you are free to swap skill builds whenever you want.
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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Snowy » Tue Jan 23, 2018 8:27 am

Mantis wrote:If the entire game had been designed as a co-op urban open world tactical shooter with a similar mission/quest structure (a bit like Wild Lands I guess) then it would have been a lot more fun.


This was my biggest single disappointment with the title as well, those early videos looked so fucking compelling, four man squads working through a collapsed NYC in the snow. Thinking on the existing gameplay too making it properly tactical with realistic bullet damage would still be amazing, especially given the way that the AI works to flank you. However emptying clip after clip into baddies just took away any feeling of reality or tactics and turned it into a pseudo-MMO disguised as a tactical shooter.

The discussion here around 'builds' just shows it too - an element of MMO gaming I always despised. If I have the gun, the position and the aim, I get the kill. That is how it should work, not some arcane stat collection.

I would still replay it as I did get some enjoyment from it at release, but I have to agree Ubi properly screwed the pooch with that decision.

Jez wrote:Was hovering over the install button yesterday evening but i hesitated mostly because of the download time and short on space on the Hard Drive. so instead decided on a few rounds of BF1. I know its a different sort of game but its just an amazingly good experience. Such great moment to moment gameplay.


I came close to pressing 'buy' this weekend, even though I hate all things adversarial :)
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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Animalmother » Tue Jan 23, 2018 10:18 am

I get the impression from the early gameplay videos that the intention was to have a proper tactical co-op shooter. But it being Ubisoft someone up high insisted it be turned into an unfinished loot grind.

As for BF1, as much as I'd love to see more people play and discover how great it can be, it can also be a cluster fuck of frustration. If you don't like MP shooters or Battlefield games in general then it might not be for you.

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Re: The Division Announced for PC

Postby Snowy » Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:00 pm

I had a deep and abiding love of BF1942 and played it for years, from the first demo of Wake Island through to the awful expansions. Adversarial game-wise, the last title I enjoyed was Planetside 2, but played with the Red Mist outfit who were really organised and made it a joy to play. These days I play no deathmatch or adversarial games at all, I got sick of loot grinds being added (just give us the fucking toys and stop adding OP shit to games that should be balanced) and most of all the toxic communities that inhabit them.

I bought PUBG a while ago on a whim and have played maybe 2 matches before uninstalling with a sigh.
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