No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Jez » Fri Sep 02, 2016 1:56 pm

It's a gut feeling and trust thing too though.

I bought the new deus ex on a whim and ignored the reviews. Many of which rebuked the games story it's performance and it's looks. I find no fault in the first two and the third is a minor thing that I pay no heed to. I found more faults like these in universally liked titles such as the mass effect series that reviewers barely mentioned for gushing.

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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Lee » Wed Sep 28, 2016 3:41 pm

The Advertising Standards Authority has confirmed to Eurogamer that it has launched an investigation into No Man's Sky.

The ASA investigation revolves around the Steam store page for No Man's Sky.
The watchdog launched its investigation after receiving "several complaints" about No Man's Sky advertising, a representative told me.

The ASA has the power to have advertisements it believes are in breach of its code of conduct withdrawn, and prevent them from appearing again. If an advertiser refuses to comply with an ASA ruling, it can impose sanctions, such as asking internet search websites to remove a marketer's paid-for search ads.

The investigation is on-going, and so the ASA declined to comment further, but one of the complainants revealed details of its response in a post on Reddit.


http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016- ... o-mans-sky
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby DjchunKfunK » Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:11 pm

The stuff on the Steam page is pretty bad to be honest, not representative at all.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby gpa-gone-west » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:05 am

Taken in isolation, NMS is a game that is best played aimlessly. To just plod along and discover stuff, and thats fine. But if you believed everything that was suggested would be in the game, then you would be royally pissed off.

Lets be honest, this sort of thing has gone on long enough in this industry, and it has to stop. I hope the ASA dont just stop at NMS, but go further. Not sure they will though.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Mantis » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:24 am

I don't think it's even that good for plodding around discovering things. Because ultimately everything you discover is just going to be a minor variation on a random string of something you already found.

Fully procedural generated games just do not work for me. They have zero soul. If I know that nothing has been specifically made with the intention for me to search and discover it, then why should I bother looking at all?

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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Sly Boots » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:26 am

Sums it up for me, Mantis, feel the same way.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby DjchunKfunK » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:32 am

I think I've said this before, but procedural generation isn't the problem it's the way it is used. There are plenty of procedural generated games that manage to be great fun.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Sly Boots » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:35 am

DjchunKfunK wrote:I think I've said this before, but procedural generation isn't the problem it's the way it is used. There are plenty of procedural generated games that manage to be great fun.


I've tried a few and always get a bit bored after the initial novelty of the game mechanics wears off. Minecraft, for example.

I think it just comes down to personal preference. I'd just rather see a smaller, handcrafted world than something procedurally generated.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby DjchunKfunK » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:37 am

Stuff like Spelunky, Enter the Gungeon and Nuclear Throne are all great examples of PCG used well.

The PCG itself within Minecraft is really well done as the variety it throws up is really good, if you are getting bored you are getting bored of the game mechanics themselves not the world in which you play. It's unlikely that designed worlds would change that.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Sly Boots » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:40 am

Not really, Dj, I love exploring crafted worlds. I'm someone who will poke into every corner to see what a designer might have left there for me to find. I've never experienced that in a PG game.

Half the reason Deus Ex is taking me so long is that there isn't a corner of the map, locked office, vault, high-up apartment that I haven't wanted to get into and see.

The problem I find with PG worlds is that no matter how many corners you poke your nose into, 99% of the time you don't find anything. What's the point of exploring if there's nothing to find?

Which brings it nicely back to NMS...
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby DjchunKfunK » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:46 am

Sly Boots wrote:Not really, Dj, I love exploring crafted worlds. I'm someone who will poke into every corner to see what a designer might have left there for me to find. I've never experienced that in a PG game.

Half the reason Deus Ex is taking me so long is that there isn't a corner of the map, locked office, vault, high-up apartment that I haven't wanted to get into and see.


I understand that, but your example of Minecraft doesn't fit that at all. They are two different types of games. It's not really so much about exploring the world to find interesting things, as it is exploring the world to find materials to build stuff.

That criticism is fine when applied to NMS and again the fault is with the PCG they use not PCG itself.

EDIT: Saying PCG is bad because of NMS is like saying crafted levels are bad because of Diakatana.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Mantis » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:56 am

DjchunKfunK wrote:I think I've said this before, but procedural generation isn't the problem it's the way it is used. There are plenty of procedural generated games that manage to be great fun.


Don't actually disagree with you. Random generation adds replay value to games and can work wonders. But NMS is as I said, a fully generated world. When your entire game is built by a computer algorithm there's just nothing to draw me in, particularly when the whole point of the game is to go out and discover stuff.

Random generation done well is brilliant. Just look at most Roguelike games that have had success in the last few years. FTL, Dungeon of the Endless, Spelunky. All hand crafted tiles and well thought out sections but generated in a random order to add variety and challenge to every game. It's procedural generation done on a smaller scale and far better off for it.

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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Sly Boots » Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:01 am

Not sure why my point isn't really getting across.

In games the main things I look for are interesting worlds to explore, goals and/or an interesting storyline.

They don't need to have all three, but those that do will be up there with my favourite games of all time (which happen to be the ME trilogy, Witcher 3 and Anachronox, all of which have all three).

With PG games, I generally find none of these things. With Minecraft, for instance, there is no storyline, your goals are to explore and build and the world is essentially infinite. I played it for about a dozen hours, built some stuff, thought it was ok. Then I put it down and have never felt the least inclination to return. For me, in that dozen hours I essentially saw everything the game had to offer me. There's no compunction to explore and infinite world because I'll never see the end of it, and the bits I do see are mechanically the same. I don't want to build any more because I've done that now, and there's no goal beyond doing so. Some people want to spend 1000 man-hours recreating a life-size model of the Starship Enterprise, but I am not one of them.

Same with No Man's Sky. Infinite universe, great. But within a few hours you've again essentially seen everything the game has to offer, and what goals it provides are so pointless and vague they offer no motivation to continue.

No-one is saying PG has no place in gaming, what I said was it comes down to personal preference, and for me I don't get enough sustained entertainment from games that promise infinite worlds where I have to set my own goals for no reward, just as there are people for whom anything open-world is a huge turn-off.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Lee » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:37 pm

Yea it really does come down to personal tastes if it works for you or not.

gpa-gone-west wrote:Taken in isolation, NMS is a game that is best played aimlessly. To just plod along and discover stuff, and thats fine. But if you believed everything that was suggested would be in the game, then you would be royally pissed off.

Lets be honest, this sort of thing has gone on long enough in this industry, and it has to stop. I hope the ASA dont just stop at NMS, but go further. Not sure they will though.


Would hope so too.
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Re: No Man's Sky [PC, PS4] - June 24th 2016

Postby Lee » Wed Nov 16, 2016 10:02 am

One of the dev's has quietly moved from Hello games to CIG to work on Star Citizen

http://www.idigitaltimes.com/no-mans-sk ... zen-568549

No Man’s Sky has faced a tortured development cycle often compared to Foundry 42’s Star Citizen, and now the two controversial space games are sharing employees. Longtime Hello Games designer Gareth Bourn signed on to join Foundry last month according to his LinkedIn page.
For No Man’s Sky followers, this news might come off as yet another sign of Hello Games’ inner turmoil. There had been rumors that the studio had been abandoned and talented coders were leaving, but now we know only half of those claims are true. While it’s not uncommon for developers to switch jobs after a project is complete, Bourn had been linked to Hello for nearly six years between Joe Danger and No Man’s Sky. A rocky procedurally generated universe seems like it wasn’t enough to keep that loyalty going.
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